ESB said: What ever "it" is -- "it" has the personal, financial, and social integrity of a cruel con artist without the essential spiritual conscience to speak out -- and up -- as Peny extends her trail of human spiritual wreckage.

Exactly, right on!! All we need to do is bring it down to earth, look at what they do, learn from how they do it so we do not become victims again, and then move on. I know it sounds much easier than it is though :o).

******

ESB said: As a footnote:
Those "group mind" group efforts at psychic attack by Werner Erhard are a matter of history and est employee/volunteer affidavit.

WOW, thats interesting. You mean that there are employees/volunteers who has sworn in a court or other such legal procedure that they used their minds to attack dissenters? I would love to read more about that, is there a web site I can check out? Where was the case brought to trial? Any documents that I can obtain and check out?

Or does these folks just speak out about it publically without it going to court, I would love to read it too if that is what it is....

ESB said: And, there exist realities beyond our personal belief.

I agree whole heartedly. I just find that my basic faith should not be tied into anything that makes me scared. But, you and I of course has very different basic outlooks in life, so we need to both take what makes the most sense to us. However, I would be very interested in seeing the information about EST using psychic techniquest to attack dissenters....

ESB said: Here's to knowing and doing that Good.

Cheers :o).

Malene

The affidavits of which I speak were unfortunately given in the context of journalistic investigation of the est cult, not in civil or criminal litigation.

The San Jose Mercury news and The Pacific Sun in Marin were the two local news papers who really got the ball rolling, then 60 Munites took over and Weiner wound up 'roasted' in the USSR, far from the clutching hands of the IRS and a now blood thursty national media.

I read about the affidavits in these local news paper's extensive multi-issue series articles including many in-depth interviews with former est employees and 'volunteers'.

For me, it comes down to this: if we can program and generate realities "out there" -- then join with others in the context of a coven, or "Crystal Cave", linking minds to synergistically increase the power of emotionally charged focusesed thought; who's to say that negativly focused activity could not have as powerful an impact.

Black Magick, Black Witchcraft, Voodoo, etc. are merely group 'programming' techniques that have been in use for thousands of years.

And Love protects.